513, 913 and 433 Guy Flat Truck with Tailboard (194757)

Here is a Meccano factory drawing for the 433 Guy Warrior Flat Truck with Tailboard. This was a Dinky Toy which was never issued. However it was obviously planned as the drawing above clearly shows.The 431 Guy Warrior 4-ton Lorry and the 432 Guy Warrior Flat Truck where both issued in 1958 and I also have the factory drawings for these.All three Guy Warrior drawings were first issued towards the end of 1956 and the amendment to add windows was added to all of them in 1960. The 431 and the 432 are found both with and without windows.For reasons we will now never know Dinky never actually issued the tailboard version, even though they did amend the drawing of a model they never made!!I have heard that a proof of the box artwork for this vehicle has been seen.Does anyone know any more about this enigma?Dave

Hi Dave, I found the box design. It was illustrated in Classic Toys Vol 2 Issue 7, page 18, as included in the article by Stewart Orr & Graham Bridges: Dinky Toys Guy Trucks, Part 2. The box example was made from a colour copy of a proof print found: Kind regards, Jan

Jan, You are amazing - there seems to be nothing about Dinky that you don't have an answer for. Dave, this is very interesting about the Guy 'Warrior' with tailboard, pity it was never produced. Regards, Don

Lovely model, pity it never went into production, I always thought Dinky could have made so much more of the lovely Guy Warrior. 'Classic Toys' is a mag greatly missed, I subscribed from Issue 1, and still refer to them now.At least the rivetted back on the Warrior makes these harder to fake! Chris Warr.

I fully agree about the Guy Warrior and its lack of variants, Dinky could certainly have made more of it. Dave

On the subject of Warriors, I picked this one up a few weeks ago, it has been repainted, but has the correct 'Supertoys' chassis, and I don't believe it's been taken apart, I think it looks much better in this colour scheme, and was very pleased to get it. Chris Warr.

So far, this topic has only included the later Guy Warrior model, so I will now post on the original Dinky Guy Flat Truck with Tailboard, the Vixen model introduced in late 1947 and offered through 1957, then replaced with the newer Warrior model in 1958. Along with the Foden's, these were the very first Supertoys produced by Meccano, and were very nicely made, accurate models of a common English truck. The early versions came with the original ridged wheels, had the first type casting, without the triangular supports by the front number plate, and also had the rear axle held in place with tinplate clips, similar to the early Foden's. The first boxes were also the plain cardboard type, later changed to the color wrapped style. I just acquired a much nicer example for my collection, and it is a very early issue, with the box coding dating it to January, 1948. The model is not quite mint, but in excellent condition, with gleaming paint and still supple tires....I think it spent most of its life in the box. The box itself is in remarkably good condition, and the label is still very bright. The end label is interesting in that it has a small picture of the model, something a similar vintage Foden box does not. I would appreciate some comment on that label...was it unique to the Guy's to have that small picture, or was that practice stopped later?Best regards, Terry

Greetings Terry For some inexplicable reason, the first six Posts have absolutely nothing to do with the topic, '513, 913 and 433 Guy Flat Truck with Tailboard (1947-57'. Only Terry's Post has anything to do with the topic, so hopefully someone will transfer the first 6 Posts to a new appropriate Topic that refers to the Guy WARRIOR. However referring to Terry's Post, neither the 511 or 512 carry a drawing on the end label so what Terry has noticed, I have not seen before, mainly due to the way that models and their boxes are photographed, mostly for auction. The end label is always on the right end, with the left end being clear of any label. So I had a look at two early Guys I have and had a look at their end labels. None of them had a drawing of the model, no doubt due to these models, the 511 and 512 had their correct drawing on the front label. I have always wondered why Meccano used the drawing for the flat truck and not changed the drawing to show the tail board. Perhaps the end label had the drawing which was probably the cheapest means of showing the model having a tailboard. Perhaps this is the possible answer, although hopefully others may have another plausible explanation! Kind regards Bruce (150) 201600502/918/1510

Bruce

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Thanks for your quick followup to my comments. Your thoughts that maybe Meccano put that image of the Tailboard truck on the end because the main image on the box top did not show it correctly might be correct. It sure stood out to me! I also wanted to ask you about what I think is a price, written faintly on box top. It appears to show 5/3, and of course, I am not sure at all that was written there originally, but does that price make sense for January 1948? And by the way, on a hunch, I just went and checked the box on my Type 1 Foden Flat Truck with Tailboard, #503.....it is, I believe, the second, later style of box, with colored paper covering. The main image on the box cover just shows the Flat Truck version, same as my Guy box, with no Tailboard, but says with Tailboard underneath the image. But that one does not have a proper image on the end like my Guy does. Do you remember seeing that? I will post an image tomorrow, but curious about your comments now!

Hello Terry The price written on the top label of your 513 Guy Flat Truck with Tailboard was applicable between October 1948 and March 1949. This is based on various price leaflets, but certainly not the Meccano Magazine, which for some inexplicable reason the prices in the Dinky Toys advertisements, usually found on page 3 are out of whack during this period. Of interest, my 512 Guy Flat Truck has the same price which is correct and that my model was produced during the same time-frame as yours.On the other hand, my 512 Guy Flat Truck has a price of 4/3 which was applicable between April 1949 and at least June 1950, so it is surprising to see a model in a box that had been long superseded still on the shelf of a Meccano dealer. Actually the price 4/3 has been written over another price, 4/- which was applicable at least during April-May 1949. Obviously this Guy was not a great seller, at least with this dealer! All the Guys when they were launched in October 1947 were priced at 7/-, which increased to 7/6 in January 1948. Kind regardsBruce (150) 20160503/919/0007

This dark blue / orange example is in my possession for exactly 10 years now, bought in Houten, in May 2006. A very nice, almost mint item, not expensive because it was without the box. The colour scheme is the same as its Foden brother, the 502/902 Foden Flat Truck with Tailboard. It has the grooved Dinky Supertoys hubs and the brand name underneath is Dinky Toys, not Dinky Supertoys, so post-1952. Despite the old number 513, cast under the loading platform, this one is a later and rather common issue, with the later triangular additions next to the front registration plate. As far as I know the cast in number has never changed with subsequent renumbering operations. Although mine has no box, this colour version is usually seen in the company of the later yellow no. 433 Dinky Toys lid box, and with an illustration in green only. Quality Diecast Toys have some nice groupings of related models on their website. This one is seen there, as expected, with the yellow box too. Kind regards, Jan